Ep.1 Robert Geils - Real Estate Advisor - NYC

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrBVeagr71A

Nodirkhon: [00:00:00] Welcome to Irreplaceable by AI. Where we spotlight work that technology can't replace.

Today's guest is a seasoned New York City real estate advisor with over 25 years of experience. Robert is a vice president and associate broker at the Corcoran Group, and previously he held leadership roles in finance at HSBC, Chase and MetLife.

He holds a dual bachelor's degree in marketing management and telecommunications management from Syracuse University. Beyond business, Robert has served as president and treasurer of his West Village Co-op and volunteers with an art program supporting New York City homeless and foster children, showing his commitment to community as well as clients.

Please meet, Robert Geils!

Robert Geils: Thank you, Nodirkhon.

Nodirkhon: The first question I'd like to ask you is to deep dive into your trade in real estate and especially when it comes to New York City.

Nodirkhon: There were lately various [00:01:00] news which impacted the real estate market in New York City. And the first one was the fallout of the Zohran Mamdani win. I don't know if it's true, tell me. Impacted in a negative way the real estate market?

Robert Geils: I honestly do not believe it has impacted that. It will have an effect—this news has one—and usually the questions come from outside of New York City. My friends in Florida, my friends in other parts of the country have an impression of Mamdani that he's going to severely restrict real estate, restrict landlords from managing and managing the rent on their properties. I don't think he really has that capability. I think he will get elected and will have to negotiate with the city council and the state, [00:02:00] and the governor. When it comes to New York City regulations it will be a negotiation and it won't be about what he promised during his campaign. I have not seen anyone that wants to buy or sell an apartment change their direction because of his candidacy. I don't expect that to happen. I think it's more important that people manage their payments—the interest rates have been much more of a factor in what people can afford. So that's my answer to that question.

Nodirkhon: This is really good to hear from you, the professional in the trench, because what I have told you is impression from, for instance, from X posts and what is in social media. We can't really rely on that. [00:03:00]

Robert Geils: Yeah, it is true that posts on social media are designed to create engagement and it's almost as if the more angry and annoying the posts are, the more attention they get. But the reality is, none of my clients are relying on social media to make their major life decisions around investing in real estate or what jobs they're going to take, or their compensation or any of that stuff. It's really entertainment. It's a lot of noise, basically. We do have issues with the politicians, what they say, because it affects our livelihood. But we're more affected by the city council. And for instance, there's a new regulation that has [00:04:00] affected landlords and renters, and that has changed things a little bit. Landlords now are required to pay their brokers if they use a broker, and—

Nodirkhon: Oh, you mean—

Robert Geils: —tenants are not. So that's a big law that just affects us dramatically.

Nodirkhon: Yeah, that's the second question I was going to ask. So you mean the one which is the broker fee ban? Basically.

Robert Geils: Right. So first off, there's no ban on broker fees and that's a major misconception. A lot of people come to look at my listings and, you know, if you use a broker to help you find an apartment, that broker can and should be compensated. It's a negotiable fee, just like you hire a lawyer or an accountant to help you do your taxes, right? If you do your own taxes, you don't have to pay an accountant, but you may do them wrong. And when [00:05:00] people look for real estate just using the internet, they have one hand tied behind their back. So having a professional in New York City—the smart people use brokers and they'll pay a broker. Maybe they won't pay 15%. Okay? So in the past that was a lot of money for somebody to pay 15% of the annual rent. So now tenants generally are paying a little bit less. They're often paying one month's fee, which, you know, if you do it yourself you may be saving a month's fee, but doing it without a broker can be a disaster. Because I know when I represent an executive looking for a home, and I'm competing against people who think they know what they're doing, I usually end up winning an apartment because number one, the landlord's broker knows what I'm doing—they know that I know what I'm doing, right? They know that I'm a professional. They know I know how to present a [00:06:00] client properly. They know my client is qualified. They know my client is not expecting something for nothing, which is often what happens.

Nodirkhon: There is constant talk about AI. Forget about the hype for a moment, but can you tell how is AI actually impacting or being applied in the real estate space? Are you seeing practical tools or is it still mostly theoretical? What do you think?

Robert Geils: No, it's very much—I would say a hundred percent of the professionals that I work with use AI. Most of the time it has to do with being a thought partner, helping us strategize our negotiations with buyers and sellers, other brokers. [00:07:00] Helping us draft mostly written communications in a way that's clear. It really is useful for that type of thing. We also have tools that are provided by our brokers, like Copilot for instance, that facilitates some of the data management that we use. For instance, if I ask for a comparables report of recently sold two-bedroom apartments in Fort Greene, it will generate that quickly as opposed to me manually having to use our proprietary databases to find that information. So it really is a productivity tool in almost everything we do. But it doesn't replace the ability—I mean, literally when that content gets [00:08:00] created, I have to check it. I cannot rely on it. That's a really risky thing, to create something without knowing what it is. So it becomes a very useful tool to help us be more productive. Maybe some communication, some graphics. There's a lot of things. We're just learning how to use it. So I think we use it all the time. I don't think anybody who doesn't use it—I think anybody that doesn't use it is putting themselves in a bad position.

Nodirkhon: That's very true. I think nowadays it has become an irreplaceable part of everyday life in various professions and also for education lately.

Robert Geils: Yes.

Nodirkhon: And [00:09:00] but what I would like to ask also is: if you look, there is AI and this is part of our living nowadays, but can you share a story about a time where you were with a client and where you knew only your human intuition and experience could have solved the problem?

Robert Geils: Um, yeah. A client—let me say for instance we had a situation. We were negotiating with another broker for their client. Their client was a buyer and we represented the seller. And we were given financial statements that, if we didn't know what to look [00:10:00] for, their client would've looked like the best possible candidate. And we certainly use tools, Excel, and so forth. But the fact is that AI could never have elicited the truth about this person's income that occurred when we actually had a phone call. I heard the tone of her voice and I understood that they were overestimating their income. And that was just experience knowing what to listen for when I'm speaking with someone. And I don't believe that AI can elicit the truth from another human being.

Nodirkhon: I see.

Robert Geils: Because I think all it does is [00:11:00] repeat what some other human being might say.

Nodirkhon: Well, I do have experience with AI, I mean in terms of how it's created and how it's built, and I really can concur with what you said—that it's basically pattern matching. So it can't think in an abstract way. And what's more, I think what you experienced—but probably what is also playing a key role here—is emotional intelligence, so-called EQ.

Robert Geils: You mentioned exactly. It did help me write a letter that was empathetic in tone to the other broker when I told them that their client was not getting the apartment. And I think it did a better job of writing an email that was, [00:12:00] like I said, empathetic. But it didn't prevent the person from calling me and yelling at me. You know, it just helped me. It didn't prevent a conflict, put it that way. And I would never trust it to take the responsibility of a human being. Especially in real estate, which—we're usually dealing in the millions. You know, if I was buying a toothbrush, maybe. But when it comes to the big decisions in life, it's just a tool. It's like helping figure out what color to paint your apartment. You know, eventually you're the one who has to buy the paint and commit to it. So I think it's a wonderful tool, but it's not something I trust to make the decisions that [00:13:00] we make every day.

Nodirkhon: From what you said, you mentioned correctly that this is just a tool and I think this is important to keep in mind, because there are extremes—like when people use this as a kind of counselor instead of going to a professional counselor or for psychology assistance. We hear different stories when it led to decisions, committing, doing really awful things based on the advice from—

Robert Geils: I've heard of really bad people using it as a friend or, you know, but all it does is reflect back things that can be really wrong. Right? I've heard some horrible [00:14:00] things. But it is a good tool—it's like any tool, you just don't hand a power drill to a baby and expect it to work out.

Nodirkhon: Exactly. And to be honest, when it comes to education I think it's especially important to use this wisely and control how it's used in schools, because I'm really happy that during my days there was no such tools. Otherwise I would have been tempted in school studies, university studies to use it and—

Robert Geils: We had plenty of tools if we wanted to cheat during my days. You know, publications that could give you a summary of a book that you were supposed to read, and it gave you everything you needed to know so you could write a paper. But you didn't learn as well as actually spending the time to [00:15:00] practice. You know, without practice you're not learning. And I think it's going to have an effect on learning in a big way. Ask any professor.

Nodirkhon: I agree with you. Robert, let's now slightly change the topic. I would like to ask you to expand more on the beginning of your career. You had an amazing career—more than 25 years in various companies—but looking back to the beginning, what first drew you to become—you started with finance and then—how did it all start? How did you choose this path?

Robert Geils: You know, it had to do with my attraction to real estate. I did know banking was rewarding but not very personal. [00:16:00] And I didn't have a lot of control over my own life. I was an employee of a large bank and I had no ability to create my own destiny. And in real estate there's an unlimited amount of ways that one can get into real estate. I think every business touches real estate in some way. I was a financial planner and a business planner, and it felt very natural for me to get into real estate. I remember my father 35 years ago when I was just becoming a financial planner, introducing me to a senior partner at Coopers & Lybrand, which is now Price Waterhouse Coopers, and—

Nodirkhon: Are you—?

Robert Geils: —he had said to get into real estate. Well, my dad never [00:17:00] got out of financial planning.

Nodirkhon: Okay, yeah.

Robert Geils: But I remember him introducing me to a second planner for a very wealthy family—the owner of the Doubleday family. And at the time I was thinking about where my career might go and he specifically said you should go into real estate. Absolutely. It's—look around who are the wealthiest people in the world. It's usually people that have invested in real estate or developed real estate or sold real estate. It can be a huge—and you don't have to be a millionaire. You can start out with nothing. So I liked it. My whole family is in real estate, so that was a big thing, right? Imagine me sitting at the [00:18:00] dining room table on a holiday and everyone else talking about real estate and me saying, does anybody want to talk about banking? And nobody wanted to talk about banking. It's boring. Whereas real estate is very exciting. It's something that you can touch, you can live in it. It's such a useful thing. It touches everyone's life. Right?

Nodirkhon: Yeah. You mentioned that no one was talking about banking, those financial things, and people were excited about real estate. You mentioned exciting. Give me one example—the most exciting thing about real estate?

Robert Geils: I would say that it's so rewarding. Part of it is at the closing table when a young person is buying their first [00:19:00] home. It is one of the most rewarding, biggest milestones. And when I'm there to hand the keys to somebody who's buying their first home, it is the most dramatic thing you can imagine that can happen in a conference room, actually anywhere. Everything that leads up to it and the moment when they go to their new home and they open the door. I still remember when I bought my first home. I've always lived in the same home. I bought my home right after September 11th in New York City, and it was a really emotional thing because I remember thinking about moving out of New York. But when I bought my home in 2002, my wife and I we knew we had made it. We knew we had really done something dramatic and something big and something that [00:20:00] was really important. So I can't think of anything that is more exciting than that—than helping someone buy their first home.

Nodirkhon: I believe this is a very beautiful moment. It's kind of giving a new stage in the life of a new family or a new couple—a new beginning, so to say.

Robert Geils: It's the first chapter of a beautiful—

Nodirkhon: I fully agree with you. I also just recalled for myself how that was and how I was excited about that. But let's say the person buying the house is having this—but you as a professional, you see this very often, right? All the time. And all those [00:21:00]—but you still don't lose this human touch to that. It doesn't—I mean, you're not used to that.

Robert Geils: Never. I think it's like—families, I love giving the keys to—his name is Nick. After everything, I mean, this is his first home and he's 50 years old. It's not like he's a kid. Um, but even for him, someone who makes lots of money and is very successful, there was something about owning a home that I don't think anyone can really appreciate unless you've bought a home. And people can talk themselves into renting forever. But I know, having rented for a long time, there's a big difference, and it's not just financial. So yeah, I don't ever take it lightly. I [00:22:00] go to my closings because I love to see that look on people's face when they get the keys. It's a really emotional moment. Maybe the lawyers don't seem to think it's that emotional, but I do. So anyway, that's what happens. It's a really great thing.

Nodirkhon: Probably this is also one of those things which make you stand out.

Robert Geils: Thank you. I'd like to think so.

Nodirkhon: Running a successful business comes with its own set of challenges. So if you look back, or maybe even now if you're experiencing—can you recall a particularly tough—what was the biggest operational or administrative headache you constantly faced?

Robert Geils: Well, [00:23:00] you know, we've hired and fired maybe a dozen employees. As a small business owner, it's the hardest part of running a business—who you're going to give the keys to to run the store when you're not there. And training people to do things that you probably can do better. But in order to grow you generally want to add staff. And I would say that that has been the most painful process. We've had many employees that [00:24:00] wanted—they thought they were owners very quickly and that they deserved to be able to set their own pay and all of that. And some—I was very disappointed in some of the behaviors of some of the young people that we've hired. And maybe it was my fault for not giving them a better expectation of what they need to do. But I gotta tell you, it's about the human part. And I don't see any way around it. I think everyone that I've ever talked to that's run a business will tell you that the most painful part of it is the people part. Because people make mistakes. It's not easy to correct mistakes.

Nodirkhon: But after so many years, can you say you've nailed it or is it still a challenge for you?

Robert Geils: You know, I think [00:25:00] I know what not to do—I've learned from all my mistakes. So I want to believe that I'm better than I was 20 years ago. But I never have the feeling that I know everything. And things change. They change all the time. For instance, the technology changes all the time. Right?

Nodirkhon: But when it comes to staffing, what were the lessons learned? What wisdom did you get from that?

Robert Geils: I would have asked better questions when I hired someone. I would have gone with someone with a little more experience. Instead of hiring someone where I used my gut feeling of, this person will be a great people person, a great collaborator, a great communicator—I made those decisions without really spending enough time comparing candidates. I think I would have been much more intentional. I would have spent more time maybe interviewing more people, spending more time on maybe a trial period, which we started doing after having a few unsuccessful hires. So yeah, I don't have the time to become an expert HR professional, you know what I mean? But I would definitely spend more time. And maybe I would use AI, for instance, to give me a great checklist of a hiring process. In fact, I did it recently when we were exploring the idea of a virtual assistant. [00:27:00] How would I evaluate a virtual assistant?

Nodirkhon: What kind of tools have been maybe used here to address this? Have you tried to use any kind of tools for this problem?

Robert Geils: I used ChatGPT in the hiring process most recently for a virtual assistant, which is a human being in India or actually in the Philippines. And we also have a virtual assistant currently who helps us with our marketing. I think going forward when I have the time, I will spend the time with ChatGPT or another resource to help me [00:28:00] formulate the questions I need to ask. What are the things that I'm not doing to get the most value from an employee? And this is a new tool. I could have gone on a podcast, I could have gone to Google and asked those. I could have watched a YouTube video. But nothing is quite as interactive. I mean, there's never been something that actually could interview me and ask me what's important to me about my hiring process. Right? And nothing that could actually be a real thought partner. And my wife has different ideas, so the three of us could communicate, right?

Nodirkhon: Regarding this staffing, I just wanted to make clear—you mentioned was it in general specifically with people like virtual [00:29:00] assistants, or is it also applicable to real estate agents?

Robert Geils: The issue—look, 10, 15 years ago there was no virtual assistant. You would meet someone. The university would send over a few candidates. And some were better than others at convincing me that they were going to be the best employee ever.

Nodirkhon: You're good.

Robert Geils: And then the disappointment occurs. But it was always about an interview or so forth. I have not even begun to use any tools for interviewing clients right now. My interactions with clients [00:30:00] is always personal. I really—first of all, I think that my natural personality would not feel authentic if I was going to rely on artificial intelligence or any of those tools. I—

Nodirkhon: But let's say—like CRMs. It's understandable you meet clients in person, but do you keep track of them with some kind of tool maybe?

Robert Geils: Well, yes, a hundred percent we use CRM. We keep track of—have I reached out? Have I spoken to them in, you know, whatever—three months, six months, a year? And the CRM definitely helps prompt me to be more productive and more intentional about keeping in touch with my clients. [00:31:00] But it's really just—it helps organize lots of information. You know, we have thousands of contacts and it's very hard to keep in touch with all of them all the time. And nothing is more frustrating than when we miss something that we should have—in fact, just tomorrow I'm going to visit someone that bought an apartment three or four years ago and I haven't spoken to them in a year and they've gotten married. I would've loved to know that they were getting married. I don't expect them to tell me they're getting married. But if I had been better at keeping in touch with them, maybe instead of just an email, maybe a phone call or a text—some of these tools would be more proactive in prompting us to stay in touch. I think there's something there. [00:32:00] But again, it takes time to integrate any kind of tool. I'm 62. It's not like I can just change how I work. So we're trying our best to take advantage of the new tools, but—

Nodirkhon: Well, I think you are quite young and—

Robert Geils: Well, thank you.

Nodirkhon: —and—

Robert Geils: I feel young.

Nodirkhon: Whoa. Well, I always was a proponent of the fact that one thing is the biological age, the other thing is how you feel and how you treat life.

Robert Geils: I am very—there's nothing more important than staying curious. [00:33:00] And that's what excites me about the technology. I love learning about what the capabilities are. And my favorite publication is the New York Times Science section.

Nodirkhon: Both.

Robert Geils: And I feel like anyone who gives up on learning—it might as well retire and it doesn't look that fun to me.

Nodirkhon: That's really true. Once the brain stops engaging, there is kind of—

Robert Geils: —it's over.

Nodirkhon: There's also—when I watched on Netflix the one called The Blue Zones, if you've heard about those—

Robert Geils: Oh yeah, we love that. That was a—

Nodirkhon: —and Puerto Rico, so [00:34:00]—

Robert Geils: Yeah, the Nicoya Peninsula in Costa Rica. I've definitely thought that was really, really interesting—those—

Nodirkhon: And it reminded me that one of the secrets they listed—like a few items of secrets of longevity—and one of those was purpose. Those people they had everyday purpose, why they were waking up, and there was always meaning to why they need to wake up and do something.

Robert Geils: A hundred percent. And the community part of it was—

Nodirkhon: Yes.

Robert Geils: —that's why you and I met. They need to wake—really appreciate connecting with other people.

Nodirkhon: Exactly.

Robert Geils: I think anything that helps create more community is going to help humanity. So look, it was really good to meet you. I hope we get to meet in person [00:35:00] soon again.

Nodirkhon: Well, we are also approaching the final parts of this podcast. I want to keep it short and sweet for you and also for the listeners.

Robert Geils: Okay.

Nodirkhon: Now in this section of this podcast it's something like a rapid round. I'm asking you and I expect you to provide the first thing which is on top of your mind. So the first question is: what is one business book that has had significant impact on how you run your business?

Robert Geils: Recently [00:36:00] I read a book called Be an AI Leader. The author's name escapes me, but it was brought to us through our company and that's where I learned to use AI as a thought partner. And it opened up AI as more than just a way of asking for directions or restaurant recommendations or asking—it's not about asking questions. It's about interacting and using it as a thought partner.

Nodirkhon: So moving to the next question. If you could recommend one piece of software or physical tool you simply can't run your business without, what would it be and why?

Robert Geils: It would have to be the Microsoft suite of tools. [00:37:00] I can't imagine not having Outlook as a tool. Although I don't use Gmail for my business. The Outlook suite really works well with the technology that we're provided by Corcoran. So I really have to say that I couldn't live without it.

Nodirkhon: Great. Now to the next question. Thinking about all the lessons you have learned, what's the single most valuable piece of advice you would give to someone just starting out in real estate in New York City?

Robert Geils: Number one, go see—you cannot be in real estate at your desk. You have to go out, walk around, visit. If you're in residential, go see apartments. If you're in commercial, go see commercial properties. If you're in [00:38:00] office, go see vacant offices and visit things. So you have to physically go visit property, period.

Nodirkhon: Great. And final question: where can our listeners find you if they want to get in touch with you? How can they reach out to you?

Robert Geils: The best way is still the telephone.

Nodirkhon: Yeah, that was the final question in this segment where we had a rapid round. Thank you, Robert, for joining and being part of this episode of Irreplaceable by AI.